On August 30, 2009, the New York Times ran a story about an allegation coming from the US Congressional sources that Pakistan has reverse-engineered and optimized an American legacy Harpoon missile bought by Pakistan in the 1980s. The timing of this article is rather curious; the story was leaked by anonymous sources on the same day that Pakistani Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani left for a three-day visit to Libya on an invitation from the Libyan government.
Pakistan’s US Ambassador in Washington, DC, Hussain Haqqani, quickly dismissed this story, saying: “The accusations are incorrect and based on wrong intelligence. We will make sure that the US understands the correct picture and we will fight back periodic efforts to falsely blame Pakistan, which remains a critical US ally in fighting terrorism. Instead of false accusations, US media should help Pakistan secure the help it needs to fight our common enemy, viz terrorism.”
The most questionable aspect of this story is the source itself; without naming names, the New York Times makes assertions that can neither be proved nor disproved. Over the years this daily has accumulated a bulging clippings file full of splashy, yet often maddeningly unverifiable exposés alleging various shenanigans. How can we forget New York Times’ “exclusive” on the presence of weapons of mass destruction (WMDs) in Iraq?
The story’s unidentified congressional source also requires some attention. When the Congress and Senate resume fall session shortly, they are scheduled to debate a $7.5 billion aid package for Pakistan. Before the House went on summer vacation, there were clear signs that this much-discussed civilian aid will be approved and Pakistan will start seeing money as early as October 2009, which is when the 2010 fiscal year begins for the US government.
This story is possibly a leak from the members of the India Caucus, the largest foreign country caucus in the US Congress. Democrat Congressman Jim McDermott from Washington and Republican Congressman Edward Royce from California are its co-chairs, and its mission states: “The objective of the Congressional Caucus on India and Indian Americans is to push the Indian American community’s agenda on the Hill.”
When the NYT story about Pakistan’s alleged reverse engineering is read with all this background information in mind, perception shifts a bit. Especially, when you consider that India’s Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and Foreign Minister S.M. Krishna are back-pedaling from their Sharm el-Shaik joint statement, it seems plausible that this story is a plant and the brainchild of Indian lobbyists.
As a nation, India’s insecure “Everyone is looking at me! Everyone is talking about me!” attitude is leading its government to involve itself with every aspect of Pakistan’s affairs. If a Pakistani sneezes, India will assume it is because there was a high pollen count in India that day.
There is another, more ominous possibility, though. Perhaps the Obama administration is persisting in the tradition of a popular Bush camp negotiating tactic, and the NYT story is the “stick” that follows promises of aid and engagement with Pakistan’s civil society. This is a high stake “tactic” that was used by the Bush administration; dates of events and the names of people and places, would continuously transform along a trajectory of a lethal narrative. The particular narrative I speak of now is, of course, the war on terrorism. Somehow, the identities of the main players manage to elude the mesmerized spectators, who watch an endless cast of characters all playing the same role of “evildoer” in “multiples theaters of wars.” In an instant, a cave-dwelling religious fanatic becomes a nationalist dictator. In an instant, an ally becomes an enemy.
Citing unnamed sources, the New York Times writes, “There’s a concerted effort to get [Pakistan] to slow down. Their energies are misdirected.”
This is a good-news, bad-news paradox. As a Pakistani-American, I am encouraged that Pakistanis seem to be rapidly moving north in pursuit of technology. The bad news, however, is more intricate. Pakistan bought Harpoon missiles from the United States in the 1980s—when Pakistan was ruled by dictator General Zia-ul-Haq—as a gesture of America’s gratitude for assistance in fighting America’s covert war in Afghanistan. Harpoons use active radar homing and a low-level, sea-skimming cruise trajectory to increase lethality. Although Pakistan owns these antiship missiles, any modification would be a violation of the United States Arms Control Export Act.
Has Pakistan really become so technologically sophisticated that it is able to reverse-engineer American Harpoon missiles and P-3C aircrafts? I recently interviewed Peter Singer, author of Wired for War, who is an internationally recognized authority on the use of robotics in warfare. He suggested that Pakistan is also working on drone and robotic technologies. I must ask, though, if Pakistan has so much technical prowess, why doesn’t the government commission experts to reverse-engineer wind turbines and solar technologies to produce much needed electricity?
This is a critical issue and if Pakistan fails to defend itself straightaway, repercussions could be serious. The speed with which the Pakistani embassy in Washington, DC jumped on this issue was a good start. I’m hoping in next couple of days, Pakistan’s government will be able to put everyone at ease.
In the past, Indians who found true love with Bush have been able to put Pakistan on the defensive. And, the Bush administration also talked from both sides of their mouths, maligning Pakistan through leaks in the media while simultaneously supporting Pakistani army generals.
One hopes that the Obama administration recognizes the role Pakistan is playing in the fight against extremism. With any bit of luck, the US government is also cognizant of a long history of friendship with Pakistan: from opening a back-door diplomacy channel with China to assisting in defeating the Soviet Union, Pakistan has delivered everything America has ever asked for. We can only hope that unlike the Clintons and Bushes, the current administration will not be enamored by the Indians. I am confident because at the end of the day, Americans are fair people. They recognize Pakistan’s contribution and understand that aberrations from established norms do exist, and government policy is completely separate from individual acts.
Ibrahim Sajid Malick is a Pakistani-American writer, technologist, and social entrepreneur. He has been writing on Pakistani society and politics since 1986. He has held several media, communications, and technology positions for organizations large and small. Mr. Malick graduated from New School for Social Research with a master’s degree in anthropology. He holds several technology and management certifications. He works for a leading technology firm and blogs at www.ibrahimsajidmalick.com
Nearly 90%of the terrorist attacks in India are backed by pakistani outfits ,most importamtly ISS.Pakistan has basically become a hypocrite nation.I dont blame the citizens, but the politicians,they need to set there objectives right.Instead of focusing on education and infrastructure ,pakistan has become obsessed with weapons and kashmir and how to counter India(a imagined opponent).
Sidharth Wrote:
“Pakistan Pakistan Pakistan…it seems the whole world, and not just India is watching it… what for???”
My friend; The entire world’s focus is on Pakistan because of the following reasons and not those that you jotted down. These reasons are;
1. Pakistan is THE ONLY Muslim Country to have the Nuclear Bombs. That is why it is labeled as the “ISLAMIC BOMB”. I’m waiting for the day when i hear the terms JEWISH BOMB, CHRISTIAN BOMB or HINDU BOMB on CNN. I have my doubts it would ever happen.
2. India is a growing economy. Hungry for energy and power. And the only way that they can get GAS from Iran is through Pakistan. If you please recall the IPI (Iran-Pakistan-India) deal that now has become IPC (Iran-Pakistan-Chine) deal, you would know. Since USA didn’t like the idea of Iran earning big money from India by selling gas to it and Pakistan getting the land passing royalty and the security fund for securing the pipeline, USA offered India the Civil Nuclear Cooperation Carrot from the famous US doctrine of the carrot and stick. One reason for that is breaking the Russian monopoly in the Indian Military market which is believed to be the worlds largest.
3. The entire Muslim Ummah (Muslim Countries if that sounds easier) look up to Pakistan and its help. Even if we provided Libya and Syria and Iran with the technology, its exactly the same right that USA has to provide for Israel. So it is not an offence at all. And we have no problems if India get the Civil Nuclear carrot because its India’s right and just like that the right of every single country on this planet.
4. RAW (Research and Analysis Wing) has been highly active in the Baluchistan region. It was funding the BLA, which to India’s illusionary vision comprises of not more than 5000 people. Our FC (Frontier Corps) and Rangers (same as your BSF) are fully capable of dealing with these miscreants carrying Russian weaponry manufactured only for the Indian market. But we chose not to go trigger happy as we feel we can bring these people out of the hypnotism. If one of these separatists are given refuge by the MI6 in the UK and he blames everything on Pakistan. At least the UK would definitely be saying Pakistan Pakistan Pakistan. So what we do is just turn a deaf ear to these guys.
5. USA cannot survive in Afghanistan without the help of Pakistan. The CIA needs all sorts of safe passages and intel from the ISI in order to be secure in the GREEN ZONE in Kabul. And this fact forces USA to again and again refer to Pakistan as the front-line ally in the global war on terror which itself is a hoax created by the Bush administration.
Now all this has to bring Pakistan in the lime light. and you would definitely hear PAKISTAN, PAKISTAN, PAKISTAN a lot. Please also check your media reports from 2 -3 months back because i read a report of a Pakistani flag hoisted in a Village in the Indian Punjab. The PAKISTAN, PAKISTAN, PAKISTAN was also heard there.
soumendra Wrote:
“Nearly 90%of the terrorist attacks in India are backed by pakistani outfits ,most importantly ISS.Pakistan has basically become a hypocrite nation.I dont blame the citizens, but the politicians,they need to set there objectives right.Instead of focusing on education and infrastructure ,pakistan has become obsessed with weapons and kashmir and how to counter India(a imagined opponent).”
Dear Soumendra, We do not back the Ghurkas, the Dalits, the Bengalis, the Tamils etc. just like 20 or so separatist movements that are operational in India itself.
Secondly, we don’t have any organization by the name of ISS. And if you’re referring to ISI. Its our first line of defense. Please check your history notes and study about RAW (Research and Analysis Wing) and try finding out what it was created for and when. ISI does exactly the same job for Pakistan and its interests like RAW does for India and its interests. Both these organizations are doing their jobs. And if RAW cannot catch up with ISI, its RAW’s failure and not ISI’s fault.
Thirdly, we’re not an obsessed nation. If we were obsessed we would have blamed India for the attack on the Sri Lankan team in Lahore. But we did not. India however, as i mentioned earlier, did not even wait for the Mumbai attacks to end and pointed a finger at the ISI and the Pakistani government. Please do let me know who is obsessed here ?
Farooq K. Qazi Says:
“Thirdly, we’re not an obsessed nation. If we were obsessed we would have blamed India for the attack on the Sri Lankan team in Lahore. But we did not.”
you could not do that(even though you so desperately wanted to) because india has had a clean slate so far and the world knows that.The USA trusting india with the nuclear deal is a testimony to the fact. And when pakistan wanted a similar nuclear deal, USA was blunt in saying “they did not trust pakistan given the history they have” [i felt it was so childish of pakistan asking for a similar treaty....have a consistent and democratic regime for atleast a decade....practice peace and progress and then may be u can ask for such things]
so pointing a finger on india over the attack on the sri lankan team would have been seen as a politically motivated joke.
Farooq K. Qazi Says:
“If we take aid from the US, we do it for ourselves. Why is India so worried about it? And even if we misuse the aid that comes in, its USA who can and should inquire about it. Why does India do that?”
That statement itself shows the attitude of pakistan….”even if we misuse the aid that comes in”…!!
You know USA will never ask about what you have done with the aid they gave you because its a compulsion for USA to help pakistan so that it stays in the GREEN ZONE in afganistan(u rightly said it).
And India is concerned because most of the aid that comes is spent on the army by pakistan and its not rocket science to guess which country are they gearing up against.
Look at history….USA once depended on afganistan to counter the USSR and when USSR no longer existed and the aid given to afganistan was being miused…look what they did to afganistan…almost wiped them out of the map.
Now just imagine….these days USA is dependent on pakistan to counter afganistan….and once afganistan gets solved and if pakistan still continues to misuse the aid they are getting….its easy to guess what they will do..!!
PS: Farooq bhai…i liked the way you asked your fellow countrymen to debate in a healthier manner and not be abusive and i respect you for that.
Cheers!!
Farooq K. Qazi Says:
“Even if we got this technology from North Korea, how come ours has an accuracy rate of 89% against that of North Korea’s 57% and India’s 64% ?”
Its because you got the technology from China.And its a well known fact that China has been a major arms supplier to pakistan (to serve its own interest of balancing the power struggle with india )
And just to state some facts of how pakistan procures missiles from china and north korea and calls it its own :-
1)Pakistan calls the Chinese M-11 the Hatf-III. The missile has a range of more than 300 km and a payload of 500 kg. It is a two-stage, solid-propelled missile capable of carrying nuclear warheads. The missile was reportedly test-fired in July 1997.
The Rumsfeld Commission confirmed that complete M-11 missiles were sent to Pakistan from China. Pakistan has reportedly received more than 30 M-11s, which have been observed in boxes at Pakistan’s Sargodha Air Force Base west of Lahore.
2)1000 km Nodong (Ghauri) missile bought from North Korea.
source:- http://www.wisconsinproject.org/countries/pakistan/missiles.html
I agree with you when you say its in every countries interest to procure weaponds from wherever they can but to boast about it as if they have invented it is not called for.
Even india has most of its weapons imported from Russia.
And to add to that pakistan has played a key role in nuclear proliferation…US State Department has warned Pakistan over lifting restrictions on nuclear scientist Abdul Qadeer Khan, saying he “remains a serious proliferation risk.”
Just like you have Abdul Qadeer Khan who is credited for heading the missile and nuclear programme we have an icon named A.P.J. Abdul Kalam who also has been the president of india and is respected the world over for starting from scratch and establishing the ISRO(Indian Space Research Organisation) and has also lead india into the list of countries having nuclear capability.[ and he is not considered a proliferation risk]
@Vinayak Gupta……. Well lets get it even more simpler.
1) Why are there news travelling that the moon mission India so proudly launched has failed? Or is it just the Pakistani conspiracy theorists on CNN again? If that counts, well Pakistan has a launched a couple of its own as well then.
2) Don’t even go to secularism my friend. Golden temple, Azadi Express and Gujrat are great examples of the secular state India is transforming into. And as i had previously pointed out, do you know a guy named Jaswant Singh who was recently fired from BJP because of writing a book? Secular indeed.
3) If all our missile technology is from China and Korea, care to explain about our nuclear technology. Yeah right! i guess we got that from India in 1947 upon partition.
4) The misuse of aid my friend! Come on you have got to be kidding me.The proposed Indian defense budget exceeds for 2009 is around $40 billion whereas in 2008 it was $26.5 billion and it is . And you are worried about us using a couple of million dollars? And yes as you mentioned that USA might just erase us from the map for misusing the aid, that should be good news for you and a lot of other countries around the world if we are actually misusing. So you should be happy and not worried for our time is near
5) And finally the clean slate you mentioned. That is actually wonderful news because then it means that the story about all the Indian consulates along the Pakistan_Afghanistan border and their agenda, Indian “historic ties” within Baluchistan, the atrocities in Kashmir and a continuous refusal to solve this issue, the Hindu-Muslim incidents within India (just mentioning the widely known ones) are all false and my dear failed state and its nationals have been living a lie for the past 62 years. Bravo!
I accept that Pakistan is at a very critical juncture and the condition is deteriorating and yes, the major fault lies with us and our leadership but let me remind you that I still believe that majority of these problems have been imposed on us from outside (I better not name the culprits ) and the fault with our leadership is their inability to handle these situations. But! Don’t you dare go innocent on us for even a second. Have a heart and accept that India has never wanted Pakistan to exist and it will continue to do so and this was long before Taliban or Afghanistan or Mumbai attacks. And i think this can be categorized as obsession!
To all Indians,
Dear Indians,
Thank you for your messages. At first all of you say that you are not concerned about Pakistan, and at the same time who have the time to reply to the posts being made at this page and have the time to read articles concerning Pakistan. WOW! Talking of Pakistan, what have you acheived, watch Slum Dog Millionare a couple of times, and you will see. Muslims enjoy democracy in India and were the same who were killed in Gujrat. You want Kashmir have it, but first consider your internal disputes. Pakistan will remain forever.
Please dont reply to this message, or else it will prove that you are obsessed with Pakistan.
As for the english, you can keep it, the British were your grandfathers and you have all the right to keep it.
Thanks
Salam to everybody.
I love to see that Pakistani scientist are so capble to develope such technologies. Technologies are same. every country has stolen technology from Germany and other countries. India has also stolen everything from abroad-they have nothing their own. Reverse enginnering is the big deal which indians cannot do. Even they have admitted that their nuclear explosions were failed…… oh accept my applogies.
In this forum all indians are seems to be angry…. its natural but the truth is bitter. The monster created by the US and Pak is now pewerful … but who made it powerfull??…. its India my dears. India does not want the existance of Pakistan from the day first. India is providing weapons, money to all terrorist of region. I wonder that indian people who are good by heart, at the same time they are so innocent that they even dont know about the dirty mindset of their government who is playing in the shape of Bombay Attacks, sri lunken team attack in lahore, manawan police attack in lahore and many more.
India should be scared that the direction of this Monster created by US-PAK might be divereted to their own country and help to make free many states of India from its Brutality. they should afraid of each pakistani who are individualy atom bomb in thier own capacity.
Indians needs understand this that all the dirty games in regions are being played by India who is illusioning to become GREAT INDIA . . . . but it will be remained and beautiful illusion
thanks
Its clear to see that both sides will turn a blind eye to the others accusations and promptly bring forth their own.
If India has such “Historic” ties with Afghanistan, they could be used in much more productive ways. 14 Indian embassies are located on the towns bordering Pakistan, Indian arms have been retrieved from terrorists captured in NWFP, FATA and Balochistan. So the argument there is valid.
Furthermore, if India is such a “progressive” nation and is heading in front of Pakistan, then they should try and reduce their own issues such as poverty and hunger, where Pakistan has always ranked better than them.
What could be a very strong world power in the form of a South Asian union, will never come into existence due to the issues faced from both sides. Being a Pakistani, i will still admit that Pakistan is also to blame as much as India, but the fire had been brewed from both sides. If we did not develop nuclear power, India would have definitely attacked us and tried to capture more territory. In our defense, our attacks are justified based on the offense made from the other side.
It is also a true fact that democratic governments in the United States have supported India over Pakistan, and history proves this. It is in under the democrats that Pakistan has faced sanctions and ill-circumstances, and part of that is resultant from Indian lobbying and part from our own actions.
It is a debate which will never end.
@Asad Hassan
Let me clarify those points a bit more:-
1)The moon mission that Indian launched has done more than 90% of the work it was intended for and has sent crucial data before it lost communication.So if u still want to consider it a failure….Its your choice.[ USA and Russia have failed on many occasions too when they just started reaching out in space....so if u consider it a failure...its good signs for us]
2)India is not “transforming” into a secular state…It already is a secular state my friend. I have a lot of muslim friends here and they pity the extremism practiced by muslims across the border.And i don’t blame you for not believing me because the pakistani public has been blinded by their biased media which is run by the gorvernment and shows india in a bad light. It a terrorist is killed trying to sneak into the indian border in kashmir…the pakistani news channels(i watch PTV too for some fun) say that indian troops have killed an innocent kashmiri (while it was someone from across the border trying to sneak in and blow himself up in some public place)
And Jaswant singh was fired from BJP not for writing a book but for pointing a finger at his own party leadership for the exchange of terrorist that happened at kandahar. [so it was a matter of internal politics within a political party]
3) If u can’t even make missiles and buy them from china and korea then let alone making nuclear bombs [making a nuclear bomb is much more complex than making missiles].And visit the link is posted for more clarity of thoughts.
5) By clean slate i meant in the direction of nuclear proliferation[you know where A Q Khan stands].And why is pakistan so worried about india strengthening its ties with afganistan?? And why in the past has USA and UK asked pakistan to shut down the terrorist camps operating in POK??
The only major mistake on india’s part was interfering in pakistan’s matter when they seperated bangladesh from pakistan. And that incident has filled pakistanis with hatred towards india and all pakistan wants to do is have a revenge by seperating kashmir from india [i can't put it more simply than that].
But just think about this…we both are a developing nation facing problems like poverty, illiteracy and many more. I wonder where we would have been now if we were good neighbours and helped each other out…rather than blaming each other for their problems.
PS:- Being a cricket fanatic i would have loved to see Saeed Anwar and Sachin open for a team….!! The indian battling line up + the pakistani pace attack could have dominated d world cricket forever…but sadly they are just dreams..!!
Cheers…!!
hindus always talk SXXX,
Vinayak Gupta u peoples are so dumb u dont know what is coming your way you havnt researched it dont u from the day pakistan waz established india is creating hurdles for it like at start poor share from subcontinent in respect of money and militRY WAZ GIVEN.
2ndly india attacked pakistan but pakistan didnt do that to ur land i certainly dont think so
3rdly kashmir was given the right to vote it is not given to them more than 90000 people are killed there by use of force.
4thly Pakistan made missles on its own created technology it doesnt apply for short range but does for long range the long range missles are feared as they are one of a kind and are not known very well.
5thly your moon mission come on only prithvi series missles are fully tested and functional and all other missles were like just tested with out war head dummy and are not full functionally tested.Prithvi iz a short ranged missled and u intend to produce an ICBM after that N.Korea is gud in that respect.It waz nt ur technology accept it.
6thly we have 3 trillion rs budget and u have more than 7 times than that budget still u lack the superior technology of Pakistan like Babur cruise missle iz created by Pakistan and ur brahamos iz taken frm russia cum on u still think that u havnt taken technology.
Ur n.missle activates in 61
our n.missle activates in 41 who iz advanced nw.
our missles hit with accuracy and urs really dont.
7thly ur n. submarine its pathetic how dumb iz that u tear its armour for refueling fissle material and dont have suitable missles for it its like having a army without guns.
8thly ur media always blames us for every thing and ur ministry too mumbai attack i waz watching tv on that day after 1hour and 30 min news came on ur news channels that pakistan may be involved u should have done investigation or u had idea that this would happen and u could not stop it its ur fault ur sources say that ship came from karachi mumbai has a water defense barrier how come ur God damn navy missed that. \\
there iz more to be said but enough iz enough settle disputes already its ur govt. that stops peace talks not us.its ur fault almost always…
Absolutely correct. The government has demonstrated not only through its words, but through its actions that it is serious about fighting the scourge of militantism and promoting democratic reforms.
Why else would we be seeing the military making advances against Taliban in Waziristan and Balochistan? And the PPP’s continued work towards to abrogating the 17th Amendment and implementing the Charter of Democracy?
If the US government felt the need to play a double-sided game with previous governments like Musharraf, perhaps they had their reasons. But the Zardari government has been nothing but a loyal partner with the US and the world community.
Leaders in the American government and the media should not be spreading anonymous rumors that hurt the reputation of Pakistan as it increases its commitments to the fight against militantism and support for pro-democracy measures.
First of all no one can tell us that what should we do .. we know our way and Americans have to understand that if we once got Islamic Revolution here in Pakistan they cannot even be able to come here on this Islamic land, yes i am talking about some American Officials who are trying to mess with Pakistan since it was made. Its true that their influence in Pakistani Politics was so effective before, but now time is changing they have to change them selves too!
And for indians, they are coward,useless and peace of a no, we had ruled over that land which they call india so we don’t even care about these jerks any more … Pakistani Nation is ready to deal with any National International fuck ups.
we Pakistani People never scared of any thing .. either its nuclear Bomb or what ever, Because we know and we believe that god is great! and when we were in a need we made Pakistan, we will gona take Kashmir as well very soon cause that was also a Part of Pakistan, so now india has to decide that either they can do it with peace full atmosphere or they want some burning Melting dirty indians over there before we take Kashmir!
Pakistan Zindabad!
Well U PPL OF BOTH SIDES….OUR ANCESTORS HAVE SUCCEEDED BRILLIANTLY…THERE IS SO MUCH HATRED THAT THEY HAVE BEEN ABLE TO INJECT IN US THAT IT CAN BE EXPLOITED AT ANY TIME…. WHENEVER THE GOVERNMENTS HAVE NO ISSUE TO PLAY FOR THEIR POLITICAL ADVANTAGE THEY ALWAYS TEND TO CREATE AN ISSUE INVOLVING THE BLAME TO THE OTHER SIDE….BUT THERE ALSO IS ANOTHER MONSTER WHICH IS IN CREATION BY EXPLOITATION OF VERY SERIOUS MATTERS SUCH AS WATER ETC…I PURPOSE THAT AS, WELL EDUCATED PPL WITH A FAIR AMOUNT OF AWARENESS SHOULD ADDRESS THESE ISSUES BEFORE THIS MONSTER BECOMES A DEATH ANGEL…AND I PERSONALLY BELIEVE THAT IF WE START ADDRESSING THESE SERIOUS ISSUES WE WILL FIND A WAY TO SOLVE THE ONES WHICH ARE PENDING!!
It took me over 40 minutes to read the comments on a 800-word essay (which started reasonably and then became totally absurd) Anyway.
1) India is superior than Pakistan – in the following ways:
a) Economy – we are amongst the top in the world in terms of purchase power parity. Please Google if you don’t even know what that means (or are not sure about the numbers). India also receives one of the highest foreign investment in the world (read investment, not alms and loans)
b) Science and Technology – India is only of three countries (ever) in the world to have made a super computer on its own. India also fortunately creates the largest number of trained engineers and techies who pretty much rule the Frisco bay area.
From my perspective, that’s pretty much the tangibles. Pakistan is still struggling, with a bit of exposed culture, why is Bollywood swirling the world and why was Lata Mangeshkar (jokingly) asked to be exchanged for giving up PoK? That aside, neither is Lata Mangeshkar so important for India nor is a small PoK. Keep it if that’s something that assuages your ego.
Seriously, India has a lot more than to spend billions of dollar on nothing. Nothing that brings back anything. It’s just doesn’t make financial sense.
From a cultural view, I accede to give it Pakistan. India is messing up it’s own culture. It is in a stage of rapid transformation which transformation is in all forms, culture, economy, money, sex, alcohol, everything. The good thing is, we are moving, we are experimenting and not stagnating. We are open to ideas and that’s what makes us the cherry of the world.
Pakistan in general is not bad. It has the most beautiful places, people, music and food in the world. But guys, please, get your act together. Try harder. Get to office by 9 am and work hard. Somewhere down the line that’s what an average India does. He works hard. At the end of day, an average India doesn’t really care about Pakistan and the nuclear deal. We are working hard to get bread in our homes and make sure that beer is available on the weekends. That’s all man. That’s how India is being looked at, from everywhere in the world. It’s been looked at positively, not suspectingly. That’s an achievement of the every day hard work that each of us put into our work. Not into our foreign policy.
Think I have gone on too long. But the whole blog is bloody with filth. And this is the case with most other India-Pakistan blogs, everyone just fights along, thinking they are making an e-point. Let’s stop making e-points and do our jobs. Work up our countries and everything else just sorts itself out. Remember, at the end of the day, you make the government, the government doesn’t make you. Good night.
India the mighty and prosperous, largest democracy of the world and on the other hand, Pakistan, a poor, unstable, almost failed state. But still the question remains which started it all. Why is Pakistan becoming an “international-obsession”? Is it because of the nukes or the taliban or our irresponsibility in fighting other’s wars or our own instability? I would leave my Pakistani friends to ponder over these. One thing is for sure. We are facing the worst crises of the last 62 years and of course whatever be the origin of these problems, we are to be blamed for we haven’t solved them. So guys from “Green and White”, think not “Who” will come and solve these problems, think how these problems can be solved. Do a little brain storming for 5-10 minutes a day and may be in doing that our poor nation can get that “Who” to lead. And yes, India has progressed far more than Pakistan, with all their techies and super computers and Lata’s and beer drinkers and 9 am office goers but the question still remains. With all this progress, why the fanaticism and obsession. We have a group called Taliban here with us and You have RSS, Akali Dal, Shiv Sena etc among the few which are the names of great humanitarian organizations . Well i suppose it comes with the larger area. Go to the moon my Indian friends because may be you ll need a place there in the future. Plus since I only get to watch PTV so I don’t know what is going on out there in the real world.
@Asad:
Thank you so much for a totally unbiased note. This is the kind of progress, which when we make, would solve problems, not create them. Just to give a quick response, I completely agree that India has religious fanaticism and that may be caused by various reasons which reasons are not important for the subject of this debate. One point however must be made that religious fanatics in India operate within the limited geography of India itself. Whatever the relationship between two countries be, India has not and will not support or harbor an organization which could destabilize international peace or kill innocent civilians. I do not believe that the likes of VHP and SS and Bajrang Dal are doing any such destabilization, or for that matter, are even capable.
On the other hand, the world at large recognizes the fact that there are numerous of such organizations which not only destabilize Pakistan but also the regions around it. So this is the question I ask Astad, do you really care about these people? Does the average Pakistani really know what are the principles of these people or what is it that they are really fighting for? I suspect no.
Now to the bone- this is all that we request. If you could that is: create a public consensus within Pakistan of what’s really going on. An information virus kind of something. Let people know what’s going on. And protest against the government at every stage where they blindfold the citizens. From this perspective, let me assure you that India is open. It’s borders are open and so is it’s people’s hearts. And oh my GOD! WE LOVE TO TALK! So if someone comes across with a clean hand (and no bullets please), we would love to talk, and live up to the promise that we make while we talk. You know walk to talk kinda thingi?
That’s about it man. I will come back to my point. Yet again. Let’s do our jobs. These things in the long turn don’t matter. It won’t get bread into your homes at the end of the day. Once there is money (self-made money) you won’t even bother to know anything else. Let me know what you think… and have a good day!
The illegal modifications in the anti-ship Harpoon missiles is a provocative and destabilising action by Islamabad and threatenes the “delicate” India-Pakistan ties. If (recent media reports are) true, the modification of these missiles would be a violation of the Arms Export Control Act. In addition, this would be yet another provocative and destabilising action which threatens the delicate relationship between India and Pakistan.
@Kabs……..
Yes you are right as far as the Taliban are concerned. They are a de-stabilizing force in this region but let me ask you that when the world recognizes them as a potential threat, why does it forget where, when and by whom were they created. Ask the famous Mr. Bin Laden who he worked for during the 90′s and you’ll get the clear picture. The only image being propagated out in the real world is that the whole Pakistan is bloody arms market where every kid is playing with an RPG. Now the people of Pakistan absolutely hate these so-called islamist militia because they know that this is not Islam, it never was. The average Pakistani is leading a difficult life because of both the economic conditions and the security situation. So when a person who has spent a long tired day comes home and switches on the damn TV, there is a news that a balloon burst in Antarctica and the Pakistan government is being blamed as well as Pakistani-government backed terrorist camps. You would think that this wouldn’t matter. Actually it does. This has created a vicious cycle. Personally if someone blamed me continuously for something I wasn’t responsible for, a time would when surely i would give him a piece of that. Now we aren’t at that stage yet but the way things are moving and spinning about blindly, i fear for the worst. You think we want to fire bullets at everybody around us? You love to talk and We sure as hell want to talk but look around you. Is the situation helping, is the media making things any better? When one doesn’t leave anyone with a lot of options, it is the one seemingly on the controlling end that ultimately suffers. We are not a suicidal nation, so stop provoking us and declaring us one and may be that would be the first step to progress.
The current government in Islamabad prides itself on being a democratic government. Prime Minister Gillani and President Zardari remind us day and night that they fought for democracy, human rights, women’s right, justice, etc, but they also celebrate a dictator’s undemocratic rein of terror. Wow.
Prime Minister Gillani has gone one step further and he is in Libya as a guest of the Libyan government to ‘officially participate in celebrations’ and to represent Pakistan. Represent Pakistan? But why, why would democratic forces align themselves with dictators? Why would people, who went to jail for democracy, sit and listen to a dictator being praised as a super human being?
It is not just sad, for me, it is pathetic.
If you read the list of who is who in Libya for these celebrations, you won’t find anyone from America, England, France, Germany, Italy, or any other democratic society praising a dictator. Then, why can’t we, a democratic country align ourselves with other democracies?
For me, and for a vast majority of this world, a dictator is a murderer, a fascist human being who is not worth listening or talking to. Anyone who violates basic laws of humanity, like Libya’s current ruler has done for 4 decades; he must be tried and punished for his crimes, not praised.
I have great respect for President Zardari and Prime Minister Gillani for being democratic warriors. And this is precisely why I think they should have stayed away from Libya. Staying away from these celebrations would have made every peace loving, progressive and common sense Pakistani proud of Pakistan’s stand. Instead, our government has embarrassed us by warmly embracing a dictator.
Starting from the story ran by NYT with unnamed sources has put baseless allegations on Pakistan. The story is aimed at maligning Pakistan’s image across the world. People of Pakistan condemn this story as it is based on ill sources; the accusations are baseless and incorrect. I really appreciate the role of Pakistan embassy in Washington, DC. Pakistan’s Ambassador Hussain Haqqani’s prompt reply on this issue is bold step, which shows his vigilance. No doubt Indian caucus is behind this fabricated story. We have seen direct or indirect Indian involvement in Pakistan. India warmly backs those factions which create unrest in Pakistan. Pakistan has evidence of Indian involvement in the insurgency in Balochistan. Lastly I would suggest for my friend Minhaj that there is no need to get high when Prime Minister Gillani is in Libya. What you say to Americans and Britisher’s when they openheartedly support dictatorship in Pakistan and pray for its everlasting. Every country has its own national interests and their leadership work according to their interests rather celebrating things……!!!!!
Dear Asad and other Pakistani dudes
the challenges that face Pakistan are immense and these are critical times for your nation, as indeed it is for us in India. India desires a stable and progressive Pakistan and good relations with the neighbor. It is heartening to see voices like yours which seek reason. But I fear that voices like yours are very fragmented and unable to counter the alarmingly growing strong voice of fundamentalism and extremism within Pakistan, a point very aptly made in the movie “Khuda Key Liye”. This strong fundamentalist voice is trying to fill the void created by a lack of strong leadership and resilient democracy in your country. Please dont let that happen. As citizens of Pakistan, you are responsible for the direction your country takes. It is for leaders within you to come forward and bring stability to the troubled nation.
Your country is in this situation today because of a lot of factors, like the setting up of the Mujahidden by the US for their own interests, which is now the core problem. You didnt ask for these but you got it. But cribbing about it is not going to achieve anything, is it? You and your fellow citizens have a grand opportunity to save your nation’s ship from hitting an iceberg. Yes my dear friends, it is an opportunity for you to demonstrate what Pakistani leaders are made of and what does Pakistan as a nation stands for. Are you going to grab this opportunity or are you going to keep cribbing? It’s like an IT company receiving a contract to migrate the payroll systems from legacy to .NET with no documentation whatsoever. While it would be easy to crib that we can’t do this and we can’t do that coz we have no documentation to explain the requirements and processes, cribbing is nt going to create any documentation.
We were blaming elements in Pakistan for the 26/11 attacks while it was still ongoing because the intelligence agencies were recording the conversation between the terrorists and their controllers in Pakistan. We knew that elements in Pakistan were responsible for the dastardly act. These elements are as much your enemies as ours. They need to be dealt with an iron fist. No mercy. They have killed Indian and other nationals in cold blood and that is how they should be treated as- cold blooded murderers and not as saviors of Islam.
These fundamentalists call for an Islamic empire in India and want to enforce their way of life on the rest of the world. This is a threat to the existence of India and the ideals it stands for. If these fundamentalist voices are not controlled by you and your fellow citizens, they will grow to be a very serious threat to us and our way of life. We will have to deal with them and we will deal with them in the most appropriate manner. It would be very sad if reasonable people like you are caught in the crossfire, but then you would have had your chance to prevent such an occurence. So I urge you and your fellow citizens to show some leadership and prevent such a catastrophic no win kind of a situation.
Quoting Master Yoda from the Star Wars movies. “Don’t give in to hate. That leads to the dark side.” “Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny. Consume you it will.”
I do not hate Pakistanis. Strings performed at my college and it was a memorable show. I love the voice of Shafqat Amaanat Ali and the Coke Studio sessions that are available on youtube. That is the Pakistan that I want India to engage with. Not people like hafiz Saeed and masood azhar whose sole purpose in life is to spread blood and satisfy their retarded selves that their life has a meaning. These terrorists need to be brought to justice. We have our own problems and are working hard to resolve them and move ahead. And we are moving ahead, whether you believe it or not. we don’t need and want another problem in our neighborhood. But for that you and your fellow citizens have to rise to the occasion.
I hope you wont let me down
Sincerely
It is just allegation
It is belied story by New York time. Propaganda gainst Pakistan.
SIMPLE SIMON met a Pie man going to the fair.
Said Simple Simon to the Pie man,
“What have you got there?”
Said the Pie man unto Simon,
“Pies, you Dumb Ass”
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[...] stories that raised concerns on the safety of nuclear assets to exposes that alleged Pakistan reverse engineered legacy Harpoon missiles; from allegations that ISI engineered attacks on the Indian embassy in Kabul to claims that ISI [...]
[...] stories that raised concerns on the safety of nuclear assets to exposes that alleged Pakistan reverse engineered legacy Harpoon missiles; from allegations that ISI engineered attacks on the Indian embassy in Kabul to claims that ISI [...]